Ep. 142 || Ask Us Anything!: Fall 2019 Edition Transcript
This transcript is made possible by our generous donors. Learn how you can join them. This transcript has been edited for clarity.
Laura: We’re excited to do another Ask Us Anything show! I think we’ve done five of these.
Emily: Yeah, we should go back and count! We do them once in the spring and once in the fall.
Laura: They are our most listened to show, which is funny because it’s different than anything we normally do.
Emily: And it’s our longest show.
Laura: It’s so long. So sit back, relax, get comfy, go on a drive, and get ready for almost a full hour of content.
Emily: It’s neat because we put out a post on social media to gather questions from our community on just about anything! Of course we have some boundaries, but we do try to find questions either we haven’t answered on previous shows, Ask Us Anythings, or blogs. We also answer ones that were asked more frequently; we cover a lot of ground. If you don’t hear your question answered on today’s show, keep an eye out because we’re going to have a blog post later in the week on risenmotherhood.com. We’ve round up any content we have related to questions that we’ve already answered in the past so that you can see how we’ve already responded to that topic. Also keep an eye out on social media, because we’re going to answer some more fun, light-hearted questions on there as well.
Laura: That article is really robust. We’ve been building it over the course of three or four years. We joke sometimes that you don’t actually want your question answered on AUA, because if we do a whole show on it, we’ll go in more depth. So if we send you to the article for your question, it probably means there’s a full show where we dive into all the caveats. We don’t have time to do every topic justice. But we’re going to sure try.
[2:55] So the first question that we had is “Is the Risen Motherhood book appropriate for single mothers?” And our answer is a resounding yes. There’s a chapter on marriage, so if it’s a sensitive topic, you’re welcome to skip that. But the rest of the book isn’t built for you have to be married or anything like that.
Emily: Yeah, we go through the gospel, and one thing we like to talk about a lot is that the gospel meets us right where were at. God can help us right where we’re at with his Word and his redemptive story to help us to follow him and to live faithfully in whatever circumstances we are in, while we pursue Christ and let that spill out in our practical actions. Another thing we’d draw out from the book is that we use a lot of our personal stories to illustrate things, but that's not the only way to apply the gospel. We’d hope any mom would come to it and read the way that we've applied it to our postpartum body image or our self care or whatever the topic is and then she can think about that for herself, coming to the Lord, read the Word, and letting that play itself out wherever she's at.
Laura: Yeah we've heard that question from older women too. They ask if they have older kids or grandkids if the book applies to them. My answer is always that the truths are timeless. The examples may feel more geared towards moms of young children, but the truths are true no matter where you’re at in motherhood. We've heard feedback from grandmas and other moms in different stages and they've said that rings true.
[4:40] The next question is, “When will the audiobook be out for the Risen Motherhood book?”
Emily: As far as we know, it will be out in mid October, and you can keep an eye out on social media for an announcement. We’ll proclaim it from the rooftops whenever it is available! Some of you remember seeing us making a trip a few hours north of where we live to go record it in a big city.
[5:21] Laura: Okay, next question! Is Risen Motherhood planning on being at any conferences or speaking engagements this year?
Emily: Good question! So the next thing that Laura and I have on the docket is to be at The Gospel Coalition Women's Conference 2020. It’s June 11-13th in Indianapolis, Indiana. Registration is now open! We’ll be there with the Risen Motherhood team. We have some fun things we’re planning so we can connect with our community! Laura and I are going to do a live podcast during one of the breakout sessions and then we’ll individually be on different panels. You can find all of those things on their website. It's good to register early, because I've heard that breakout sessions can fill up.
Laura: So do hotels.
Emily: Yes, so if you want to go definitely go check it out.
Laura: Get a group of your girls together! People fly in from all over the country, all over the world. It’s so good! This will be my third time going, and it's always like drinking from a fire hose. You're going to need to decompress afterwards; have people to chat with. But it's really fun and if you end up going, we’d absolutely love to meet you. There will hopefully be some organized times when everybody can connect! So go to their website to find out more, and the information will be linked in our show notes.
[7:07] Emily: Laura, I’m going to ask you a question now. What about the shop and merchandise? When will merchandise be available again?
Laura: Oh yeah! Every time we wear our shirts on social media, there are a lot of questions about getting a shirt—which is awesome. We love that you’re excited to sport your R|M branding! We do a pop-up shop once a year, and it’s planned for November 4-11th. Keep an eye on social media! So that we can serve you guys best, we've actually designed it so that once you place your order, then the shirts will go into production and be shipped to you. We won’t run out of things! But shipping will take longer.
Emily: It just takes a little bit longer. It’s not two-day shipping.
Laura: Yeah, it’s not Amazon two day shipping. So in the world of Amazon, it feels like forever. But the point is that in the past we ran out of product and it has been just devastating. [Laughter]
Emily: Yeah, it’s a bummer. We want you to get the sizes that you need! Get it for your friends, for your Christmas shopping, or whatever. This way, you can get whatever R|M thing you wanted and whatever size you needed; we're not going to run out
Laura: We will have plus sizes this year! That's a cool thing. And some new things, like a tote and a tumbler. We have new coffee mugs! We hope you guys will enjoy the shop, and we’d love to see all of your merch out in the wild.
Emily: Yeah, I wear mine every day all over Iowa...out in the wild. [Laughter]
[8:27] Laura: Okay we're going to move on to deeper, more serious topics here. And the first question is when you have spiritual slumps how does that affect your time on the podcast?
Emily: Laura, do you want to start?
Laura: Sure, I can start. [Laughter] It’s crazy to say it's been almost 30 years that I've been a believer.
Emily: Awesome, praise the Lord.
Laura: I know, I feel like that’s neat. In that, I’ve come to expect that dryer seasons are a bit more par for the course. I expect them. I just know that they're a little bit part of the rhythm of Christian life. I don't know why at times God chooses to withdraw or to allow us to experience those hard seasons. But I know that regardless of how I feel, the most important thing I have to remind myself is that God is always near, always present, always working for my good. I think of Deuteronomy 32:10. There's this beautiful part where it says, In a desert land he found him in a barren and howling waste he shielded him and cared for him he guarded him as the apple of his eye.
If I'm the apple of his eye, if God is protecting me and caring for me, that promise is so encouraging. Even in the dry seasons, even when I don't feel special to God, I know I am. The apple of someone's eye means you’re so special! I think that's been really helpful. I also remember that God holds faster to me than I could ever hold to him. Hebrews 10:23 says, Let us hold fast to the confession of our hope without wavering for he who promised is faithful.
I think remembering scripture and preaching the gospel to myself has really helped. I think also knowing and striving to have a deep well to draw from in these seasons. My faith needs to be something that is authentic and real behind the scenes of ministry. We have a podcast, which is work. Sometimes it's easier to put out a show, and sometimes it's a little bit more of a grind. I think that’s okay; that’s what work is like after the fall. But there’s an element recognizing that if I have a slump, it doesn't mean I'm a bad Christian. It just means this is part of the normal rhythm. But I do want to make sure in those deep seasons of abundance, I can really dig my well a little bit deeper, so that in those other seasons of drought, I can draw from the work that I've done in other seasons—if that makes.
Emily: Yeah, I can really connect with what you're saying. I think the reality is that anything in life—whether it's work or ministry or just doing things around your house with your kids—some days it's really resonates with you and other days doesn't. You feel really passionate about this and really excited, and then there are other days, you're just kind of doing it. You know you realize the purpose of it and the importance of it, but maybe you're just having an off day, or feel a little worn down, or a little distant, and you're not quite as passionate about it. That's true for us when we record the podcast sometimes. There are days I can’t spit out a complete sentence.
Laura: Oh my word! We totally have those days when we look at each other with big eyes, like what is our problem?
Emily: I think that happens in every area of life and ministry, but we try not to get too discouraged by it. I want to share a few things I counsel my heart with out of 2 Corinthians 4. I'm going to rattle off and scrunch a bunch of scriptures together:
Therefore, having this ministry by the mercy of God, we do not lose heart for what we proclaim is not ourselves but Jesus Christ as Lord with ourselves as your servants for Jesus's sake we look not for the things that are seen but to the things that are unseen.
First off, our ministry is by the mercy of God. It's by the mercy of God on days where we feel awesome and we're ready to podcast and we're spit out okay stuff. It's by the mercy of God on days where we don't feel that way. It’s by his grace that we get to do this.
The second thing is that we’re here to proclaim Jesus and to serve you, the listener. When I think of a servant, they're not someone who just comes to work when they feel like it. Servanthood is a posture of life. We get the privilege of sharing Jesus with you! It really is a mystery and a gift—even on days when we're tired and our brains are foggy.
Additionally, we look to the things that are unseen. Sometimes we see our fumbled words or we can't complete a sentence; we’re tired or maybe something else is going on in our personal lives, making it a little bit more of a struggle. But that’s not what we look to. We’re look to Christ. We know he’s able to work through us—even tired, empty, afflicted vessels—to spread his good news. That’s what we place our faith in; not that we’re going to show up and have something amazing to say every single week.
But also, the reality is that we do keep tabs on if it’s an off day or week, or maybe an off couple of weeks, or a whole season where we repeatedly struggle and feel dry. If that ever happens, we definitely do discuss that with each other and find out how we can have rest, making sure that we’re nourishing our personal relationships with God. So it's not like we’d plow through forever. I don't want you to hear us say that.
[14:14] Laura: Or we change the role or the output—the creative piece.
But yes, you can't get freaked out by not loving it today. It’s kind of like working out you're supposed to do it even if you don't feel like it, I don't know, but there are days of euphoria. The next question is for practical advice on how to build rest into season of ministry.
Emily: I think we wanted to get a little bit practical on this question, because we did shows this season on life and ministry, and what it looks like to work hard and to avoid seasons of burnout. But some things that have helped me are having really consistent time in the Word of God that's not about preparing for a show, talk, or something I need to do at Risen Motherhood. It’s really about me growing in my knowledge and love of the God of the universe, and having that private personal relationship with him that's restful for me. Another thing I try to do is try to keep consistent ministry or work boundaries. Yes, there are exceptions. Sometimes we need to flex outside of that. But it really helps me to know when I’m pouring out into this specific type of ministry and when I’m supposed to be focusing, resting, and doing other types of things. Another thing is to take longer breaks from time to time. I think that's something that we really appreciate about Risen Motherhood, because it can kind of ebb and flow. Sometimes we are in a really heavy season of recording and pouring out, and then sometimes we’ll get three to six weeks where we’re still working and doing projects, but it's a different type of work that allows us to rest and recharge. Another good thing is to do things far in advance. I think that in our modern digital age, there’s a content machine mentality. There's always pressure about what you’re going to post tomorrow or what you’re going to produce, or when it’s going to come out. It can feel like you're always trying to keep up, but whenever we've done things far in advance, it doesn't feel like that. We get to work more when we're feeling more inspired to write that microblog or whatever; it's less about produce, produce, produce. Instead we ask how can we faithfully give you the best content that we possibly can that most reflects the gospel. And a really random thing I’m trying this year is trying to read books that I want to read, that I'm interested in, and not just books that I feel that I have to read because that's what everyone else is reading. So I have several books that I have stumbled upon that I’m going to read because I want to.
Laura: That's one of mine too! Reading books that aren't Christian non-fiction, going outside of that has been helpful. For me
Emily: So practical ways of rest in ministry for you, Laura.
Laura: Well, that was one of them. [Laughter] Yeah, I echo all of the things that you said. I definitely think daily quiet times being a priority is so important. At the beginning of the year, I had this realization that I was constantly studying God's word thinking how to spit it back out again. Where is this going to fit? Is this a microblog? Is this a podcast? Is this a conversation with a friend? Is this a way that I can talk with my son about discipline? I was taking in so that I could spit it right back out. And that was really convicting for me, because it was take, take, take, and I wasn't doing anything to give back to the Lord—even though on the surface, anyone who saw it would’ve said I was. But I think my heart motivations weren’t in the right place, and I wasn't loving God for who he was. I was loving him for what he could do for me. So that’s been something that I’ve said, “Lord, I'm here to worship you, to learn about you, and if this stays secret forever, that’s okay.” That has been a big big part of rest for me.
I try not to work after 3 p.m. each day. I also take a true Sabbath, so I really don't work at all on Sundays. That’s been really helpful for my mental health, because for a long time, that wasn't what I did.
I finally found the motivation to workout—not to lose weight, because that just never happened [laughter]—but I found motivation to work out, because I felt like there was such a stress release. I started doing that more consistently about a year ago, and it was something that helped me feel what I was feeling inside. I felt so weak. We had to write the book, we were putting out a lot of shows for the podcast, we were getting more speaking opportunities, and things were just really changing with the ministry. I felt really weak and like I couldn't do it, I wasn't prepared. I was tired, but working out for me actually became helpful when I realized I have a physical example of how I feel on the inside. Somehow that was almost healing for me. It got really deep there. [Laughter] Not that working out is for everyone and all seasons, not at all. But for me that was helpful. I’d say the last one is listening to worship music. I found throughout my days, I’m constantly listening to words, words, words—whether that's email, social media, or Voxer. I have to process and think really hard about whatever the words are—whether it's a small task or a big project. So I slow down and play music I can soak in. You don't have to think as much with music, and I can give glory back to God without really engaging the mental heaviness in my brain, if that makes sense. I found that to be really helpful to slow down and take a midday break to reorient my heart on the Lord. Hopefully, those are some helpful tips.
[19:54] Laura: Alright, the next question is how do you handle the messes in your home?
Emily: This is a good one. Last night, I was getting ready to prepare this answer and out of my mouth came “How do they make such a mess?” when I walked in We had tacos last night, and somehow the rice exploded off of their plates.
Laura: Rice is the worst to pick up. Let it dry. Cheese is awful too.
Emily: I love letting rice dry. My husband doesn't like it, because we like the clean house in the morning. But it literally cleans up instantaneously once it's dried. So we get it, we totally get the mess thing.
I have a lot of thoughts about mess that seem in opposition to one another, but when I think about them all at the same time, it starts to make sense for me. So the first thing I wanted to say is that messes are not good or ideal a lot of the time.[Laughter] They are sometimes the result of people using things and being careless. At least that's a lot of what it is in our house. Maybe kids are playing with one costume and instead of getting out their one costume and putting it on, they string out 20 without a thought about how's that going to impact mom or how's that going to impact siblings. They're not thinking about those things, so a lot of times, it can be a reflection of poor stewardship of material things or maybe being entitled and self-centered. I think it's even something like a child or a grown-up who's like, I want to take a shower but I don't want to have to pick up my towel, so I’ll throw it on the ground and leave a mess. There’s this reality that messes can be a reflection of the fall and the sinful things in our hearts. But messes can also be a catalyst for gratitude. On the other hand, the fact that we have messes—the fact that I have rice all over our table—means that God has provided for us. He's provided food for us, praise the Lord! We have toys everywhere, praise the Lord! We have children in our home; what a gift and provision from God. On the one hand, it's like, “Argh!” On the other hand, there's so much to be grateful for here. Finally, I have to remember that messes are a reality of life after the fall, but in redemption they are also a chance to serve. They're not always good; they do sometimes reflect carelessness or the reality of the broken world we live in. But my job as a redeemed woman and follower of Christ is to love, to serve, and to give even when things are not neat and tidy. I was thinking about how Christ entered our mess and he took the full weight of making us clean upon himself. That doesn't mean I'm always going to take it upon myself to clean the kids’ messes. That's not the application I'm making. But I want my heart attitude to be willing to enter into the mess with my family—whether that's a mess on the table or a mess in their heart. Okay, now practical things to prevent the mass: Train them what to do and don’t have too much stuff. Make it easy; the harder it is to clean up, the harder it is for everyone to do it together. Do it frequently, like multiple times a day. Get everybody together and say, “This is the whole family’s responsibility! We’re all going to do it together!” That's how I handle mess!
Laura: I think I would just add that messes are work. It's this extra work that I shouldn't have to do, but then I remember that God created us to work. That was part of his original mandate for us before the fall and work isn't because of sin. We can find that in the creation account, so I know that I can reflect God's image as I serve the people in my home. In effect, sort of restoring creation to its original state. I think I have to remind myself that whenever I'm cleaning with a joyful spirit and hard working hands, I am actually making an impact on eternity. That has been a good motivator for me. Someday my kids will look back and remember Mom faithfully serving them in the quiet unseen things. Or a husband feels loved because a mom is silently serving and he's freed up to do other things. This might be because a friend sees your different perspective or your different attitude on cleaning up the mess in the home and realizes that you're not grumbling all the time, and wonder why you are so different and not complaining about these things. There's this beauty of being able to image God and reflect Christ as we do this with a cheerful heart. And like Emily said, it's not Woe is me I'm going to take every mess and no one's going to help me. That's not the attitude. But sometimes I just don't want to do more work than I'm already doing. However, choosing to engage in that mess with a joyful spirit, choosing to bring my children alongside me and be okay with their attempts at cleaning things up—it's a chance to do what Paul says in 1st Corinthians, “be imitators of me as I am of Christ”. So we show our children what it looks like to be a life poured out as a drink offering when we work and we serve with our families with joy, even in the mess. So that's the only thing that I would add that for me personally has been a helpful motivator.
Oh, and Courtney Reissig has a great book on this, so go read Glory in the Ordinary. We’ll link it in the show notes. It's a very very helpful book on this particular topic—the work of the home.
[25:42] Emily: We are going to move on now to a pretty commonly asked question. Some of the questions we got are grouped into this, but basically it’s, “How do I deal with mom guilt? what do I do?”
Laura: Well, we do have a whole show on this, and even though we haven't talked about it in a while, we will link to it in our show notes. We’ve also covered it in a lot of our interviews that Emily and I have done recently. But the first thing that we want to tell every mom is that you do not have to live with guilt. That does not have to be your constant companion. So don't ignore guilt if you feel it! We would encourage you to figure out what is under the surface. Remember there's no condemnation for those that are in Christ Jesus. As you explore this topic or you think about what's going on, you can ask yourself some questions. Is there an area where I'm struggling with sin where I need to repent and change? Or is this an area where I'm not doing anything wrong and I need to recalibrate my heart and conscience to the word of God? So there's two options once you say okay, I'm feeling mom guilt.
Emily: This can be really tricky to sift through in your own mind and heart. We've heard of the term “confirmation bias”—whatever you already think or you already believe. So sometimes, when we come to the word of God or come to God in prayer, and we're trying to ask him for wisdom, Is this sin or is this not? Help me know what to do? We're kind of looking for something that confirms what we already believe. So this is where it's really important to have godly friends, have older people, have a husband have somebody or multiple people that can come alongside you. You can ask, Hey I'm feeling guilty about X, Y, and Z. Can you help me understand what God's word says about this? Can you help me point me to some resources and talk through this with me ask those hard questions of the heart? We'll link some x-ray questions that David Powlison, too. Study topically, and I think we would also just encourage you to pray earnestly seeking wisdom. Whenever we ask God, God examine my heart see if there's any sin in me. That’s a godly question that honors him! And he is faithful to show us where we need to repent. And if there isn't a clear sin, he is also faithful to give us wisdom to point us to the truth of his word.
Laura: Yeah, if you have more questions on this definitely head over and find our show notes on mom guilt.
Emily: Because the final answer is freedom on either side. Whether you realize that you had to repent— there's freedom there. Or whether you realize you were just taking on some expectations of the culture or thinking that you had to do something a certain way that you really didn't have to do.—there's freedom there. So it's just great that in both answers, there's freedom.
[29:18] Laura: How do you decide on what church is the right fit for your family? Emily, do you want to start with the high level and then the personal?
Emily: Sure. I think what's interesting, is that so much of this is just the Lord's timing and what kind of things are going on in your life and you move to an area. So we're going to give some principles, but also know that depending on where you're at geographically, and what things are going on in your life, it may be more difficult to see some of these things become reality. We just want to recognize it's still a challenging topic. I would first say, find a church that is unashamed of the gospel. That preaches it clearly, week in and week out from the Bible. Similarly, find a church that has a commitment to really understanding the word of God and submitting to it fully. Not just the things that feel good or that make a really good topical study or sermon or spun to fit our modern culture. I do think that's out there. If you just go through the Bible and pull out what seems to fit what we want or what’s going to sound good in the ears of the people, that may not reflect the full counsel of God. So I think that's like the number one thing that I would look for. A question that my husband and I also ask is not just where can our family be served? but where can we serve? A church is a body and a family, with Christ as the head. Look for a church where the culture isn't just “show up, consume, get what you need, and leave” but really “do life together.” Do these people pray for one another and serve and love the community and go on mission together? And then my final thing to share is this—make a decision in faith. I think that whenever my husband I have wrestled through different things at different points in marriage related to church, what we're kind of wanting is to have this vision into the future. We want to figure out how things are going to turn out. If our kids go through this children's ministry verses that children's ministry, or if we serve at this church with this mission bent or at that church, we kind of want to know, what’s life going to be like in 15 years? How's everything going to turn out? But we can't know that! So the best thing we can do is just find a church where we can serve, that is being faithful to the truth of God's word, and then trust God to use that church in our lives and to not look back. Yep, things might have gone differently at a different church, but God directs our paths. That's a few high-level things.
Laura: I would concur with all of those things. Preaching the gospel, stepping out in faith, I just fully agree with the, “how can we fully serve the church?” question, so I'm going to echo those things. The only thing I'm going to add is about “church dating” (as my old pastor used to say). Some people refer to it as “Church shopping” but he says there is more commitment to it than that. We've been church dating quite a few times as I've been a mom as we move to new cities, and I think one of the biggest things is just to remember, it's okay to not be totally in love with whatever church you're making a commitment to. I think we want to feel like, I just love everything about this church. It meets all of my needs. It's totally the style and the vibe that I want. All of the third order doctrines just completely line up with mine. You know, when you feel like you’re looking for the perfect church, but the reality is there is no perfect church. In fact, more than likely, whatever community you're in may not offer a church that does everything exactly the way that you would. I would just encourage you to take a step of faith. You're going to see things that you don’t love. Either right off the bat like or as you get deeper and deeper into church. Things that you don't love and you wish you could change. Or, you might even think of a better way to do things! But your job isn't to step into a church and manipulate and strong-arm it. So don't join thinking, well these are the seven things that I'd like to see changed within a year! You're joining a body—a family! They are as they are. Hopefully, God will use your gifts and you will be able to invest and make some changes for the better because we're all called to be swept up into that mission. But, if you join with this idea that I don't love it but I want to see things change or I'm only going to join a church that I absolutely adore, you're probably not going to find a church. And it's really important to be connected to a local body of believers.
Emily: Yeah, I think to rewind a little bit, Laura mentioned the third order doctrines. I think we talked about this in a previous Ask Us Anything. We’ll make sure to link that on the show notes if you're like, wait what are they talking about? Because we’re talking about the levels and triage of biblical orthodoxy. First, we want to go to a church that absolutely believes the true Bible and the true gospel. Secondly, we want to go to a church where we align on things where it’s pretty difficult to go to that church if you don't align with what they believe on things like women's roles or gender issues or baptism, etc. Those are definitely important “gimmies” right off the bat. It’s good to find a church that checks those boxes. But then there's a lot of other things like style of worship...
[34:36] Laura: ...how your children's program works, what your women's ministry does...all sorts of things! Okay, another question, how do you know that your saved?
Emily: We really appreciated getting this question because some of you may listen, week in and week out, and you’re really interested motherhood and the gospel. Maybe you've never heard the gospel presented this way before and you haven't thought about it deeply for your life. Or maybe you think you’ve been a Christian for a long time, and as you process through these things you're find yourself wondering, wow do I really know Jesus Christ, do I really have a relationship with God the father? So we're glad you're asking those questions and we want to address this because it really is important, and I think there can be assurance. So first off, we have to have true belief. Acts 16:31 says believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved. 1st John 5 says that we have to believe that Jesus is the Son of God because whoever has the son has life whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. There's another verse in Romans 10:9-10 that says, because if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. So there's some really clear statements there. I do just want to note, that we also see in the New Testament that even the demons see and believe in Jesus, but they don't have faith in him. That's why we didn't just say “belief in Jesus” but true belief. I've heard this question phrase before well. It's not do you believe in God? or do you believe God? Believing in God is like, I believe God is real. And I believe Jesus is real and I believe that these things are real. But that's different than saying, I believe you God, I believe who you are, I trust you, even when I can't see. I put my faith and my hope in your promises! and going back to those verses, we might say, I confess with my mouth that your Son is Lord and that I am going to follow him! That's the type of true belief were talking about.
Laura: Yes, and that true belief will produce good fruit. This is that second marker you can look for. Ask yourself, Am I striving to obey God? Do I love my neighbor? Do I want to tell other people about Jesus? Do you feel a pull in your soul to do what’s right in God’s eyes? Do you love the things of God? Those things are good indicators. James 2:18 says, “ But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.” We know that doing the things of the Lord—loving kindness, long-suffering, sharing the gospel with an unbeliever, being part of a church body—those are often marks of a believer. So if your soul is inclined towards those things, then in can be an indicator that the Spirit is at work in your life. Also, I think there's often this feeling of tension that we wrestle with, because the work of Salvation and faith is so much bigger than us. That's why it's called faith! It takes a leap in order for us to get there. I think it has been a comfort to me to know that God is okay with my doubt and that he's not surprised by my weaknesses. He's not fretting about whether or not I’m saved. He knows, and we can trust him. He's playing the long game. My faith is secure, not because of the power of my faith and belief, but because Christ died for me. He won my salvation and it is secure. It's never going to change.
Emily: Just that question just to wrap up that question, at the end of the day, our salvation isn't based on how we feel. Or how much we sense God's presence at this very moment. It's based on the person and work of Christ and our belief that his sacrifice covers us. It covers us on the days that we are feeling God’s presence and we've got all the mountaintop experiences...and our faith is in Christ alone on the days that we feel far away from him or things seem dark and distant or we’re having confused thoughts and those doubts. I just love that final thing to go back on. No no matter what, that's what we put our hope in.
[38:50] Laura: Okay next question we're kind of moving into the topic of marriage here. Someone asked I'm struggling with being attracted to my husband, how can I fix it?
Emily: This is really interesting. We wanted to do this question because we felt like it encapsulates a lot of other questions that we get asked—but it's a different take. Some of the questions we get are, I'm struggling with the desire for sexual intimacy with my husband or I'm struggling because I don't see my husband growing in his relationship with God or it seems like he has a lot of different interests than me or he's not engaged as a parent. What those things can bubble into is this reality that in a broad sense, women are struggling to be attracted to their husbands because of all of these things they feel like he's not meeting the mark on. So it's more than just physical—it could be emotional, it could be spiritual, there could be a lot of things that make attraction hard. And of course, Laura and I want to say that we’re not marriage counselors. You may need to talk to someone else. There are many, many complex situations in marriage. We live in a broken world after the fall. Sin needs to be dealt with—sometimes on both sides. So don't hear us say, oh this is just simple just package it and deal with it this way and move on. It might not be. One thing that has helped me at times it to remember back to the early days of love and attraction. I imagine Emily “back then”—when I was engaged. What would I think of Emily today? How I'm treasuring my husband? I also like to remember those early things that really attracted me to him. The things that I thought were just incredible qualities. These were the reasons why I wanted to marry him! I still see many of those things in his life, and I just need to remember them and thank God for them. Or maybe write them down or revisit those ideas. I think another thing that can really help is just to pray daily for my husband. As I pray for him, my affection grows for him. Even my spiritual affection towards him! I grow in my appreciation of the things that he does for our family and the ways that God is growing him. Prayer is a reorientation of our hearts around God. That can really overflow into our relationship with our husbands as well. I think another thing is finding ways you can have fun with your spouse. Sometimes there has been a lack of connection for us. We really need to do something fun as a family or maybe after the kids go to bed. Or we need to talk or play a game together or find something to reminisce and laugh about. Those are really practical ways to stir up love and affection.
Laura: Yeah, every once in a while, my husband and I will have to intentionally say, okay tonight we're not going to watch a show. Let's just sit on the couch and talk. Sometimes we have to schedule talk time, because naturally, we’ll go into veg time. You can also think about his godly qualities. No matter what, there are probably great things that your husband does. So often, we fixate on those negative things we see. But if take a moment to notice the things that he is doing well. Maybe write them down maybe or add that to your prayers. We've talked about it in the Risen Motherhood book in the marriage chapter that I wrote on too. Exploiting the good character qualities and helping him continue lean into his giftings is great. Lastly, remember that it's probably not going to get fixed right away. That’s what marriage is. We’re going to love and show devotion in sickness and in health and the good times and the bad when were richer when were poorer. This question is just so helpful is to remind yourself, how would I want my husband to treat me if he's not attracted to me in this season? So often, we’re only focused on, well I'm not attracted to my husband and it’s his fault. But our husbands probably struggle at times to be attracted to us! I guess I know my husband is always just so “steady Eddie” and I can't really tell a difference in how he's treating me, which is so good, because I think there are harder seasons where he's loving me anyway. And that's what I want to show him as well—not being hot or cold according to my emotions, but loving him well, treating him as I would my neighbor. As we’re commanded to do—with love. I want to invest in that relationship because it is so important.
[44:00] Emily: Amen! Okay, now we're going to shift gears again into grief and anxiety. So one question we got was, do you have tips or verses for giving yourself grace as you work through personal grief, anxiety, etc.?
Laura: Yeah, this is such a good question. It's something that I think I've really grown in over the years, but of course, have a long way to go. I think the first thing to remember is with this phrase “giving yourself grace.” My old pastor said that he wishes everyone would rephrase that to “lean into the grace that is already there for you.” That's something I've always loved and has really changed my mindset. We can't really “give ourselves grace,” because God is the only one that gives it. Far too often we give ourselves too much grace. We're kind of saying, oh now I can be lazy, impatient, unkind. I've heard it referred to as “cheapening grace.” The grace that Christ bought for Christians is so very costly. It has everything we need. It’s completely sufficient for us. So that's the first thing to remember you process grief or anxiety. And remember that God's grace isn't designed to make us more comfortable in our sorrow or our sin or with the brokenness of the earth. His grace is designed to save us from the penalty of sin, to a life of hope for eternity. Second (this is been a newer thing in my relationship with the Lord) is learning to truly lament. Lamenting is crying out to God and telling him your sorrows. I think it's so good to remember that we can approach God and say things like God why? How long? Why can't I see or hear? Have you left me? These are things that we often feel in grief and anxiety. David said these things in the Psalms. It’s voicing your sorrow, while simultaneously speaking and affirming the promises of God. You can trust him in the midst of your pain. You can move from asking these questions and move towards rejoicing—reminding ourselves of who God is what he promises. It's really just “preaching the gospel to yourself”—something that Emily I talk about all the time—but I think the key in the grief is knowing that you can come to God when things are really dark and you can say exactly how you feel. God can handle it. Mark Vroegop’s book, Dark Clouds Deep Mercy, was really helpful. I recommend checking out that book if you want to learn more about the topic.
Emily: Yeah, I also think that grief can sneak up on us. It can be a very fickle thing—one moment we're doing okay and the next minute we're overcome with grief and we need to turn to God. I think that's something I've learned—that I need to learn to be okay with not being okay. I think there was a point in my life where I felt like I'm only being faithful if I'm joyful and if I'm having a great day and I'm seeing fruit everywhere and I'm praising God and I'm in a good mood. But there is a way to have a grief-filled day or a “down” day, in faith. Maybe faith looks like lamenting to God or my faith looks like believing his promises when I can't see a shred of evidence that day. This happened to me lately when I took our kids to special needs night at our local Orchard (agro-tourism)...it’s basically a night for families who have kids or adults with special needs. As we pulled into the parking lot, all of the sudden I was caught off guard. I just started crying and I didn't even know where it came from. I was overwhelmed with this feeling of We're here, why are we here? I felt so sad for our son, I felt so sad for just the brokenness of the world and the way that it impacts people and the fact that we even have to have things like this. Typically in the past, my response to myself would have been, stop it. Pull it together, Emily. This night is a great thing to be thankful for. I would want to go immediately to the reasons why this is a good thing and just move on. But I had this new thought—no, it is okay to be sad about this, cry for a moment, lament this, cry out to God and then thank him. I gave myself a minute in that driver's seat to sit there and to feel sad. For some of us even that can be really hard. To just sit and feel sad.
Laura: I think that's a really helpful story, it’s funny because I was at the same night as Emily and I had the same thing happen to me when we were watching the pig races. [Laughter]
Emily: This is so hard to describe to people, let me explain the pig races.
Laura: I’m feeling a little embarrassed right now.
Emily: We are just contrasting deep heavy stuff with really funny stuff! So there are stands and you sit and you go, hey piggy piggy piggy piggy! Then little pigs come running through this gate because they get a treat at the other side. They call it “pig races” and you go watch the pig races with your kids. So we’re sitting at the pig races...continue!
Laura: Yes, so I had this exact same feeling! It's not funny that I felt that way but just the pig races that we just told everyone about are making me laugh. Welcome to Iowa. Come visit us anytime! But it's so true—it hits you out of nowhere. Sometimes it's in a public place where you just want to stuff it down—and there are obviously appropriate times to not go through that—but I just want to say, I identify with you. You're so right that letting yourself grieve and feel the feels and to say, God I don't like it, I wish it were different, is okay because it's not going to be this way forever. Everything sad will come untrue (isn't that what Tokein says?). We can feel all of the heartache and all of the pain and know that we grieve with hope. It’s okay to do that because it’s a very real thing—you're not doing something false. You're not conjuring something, you're not making it up. It stinks and God can hear that. He wants you to mourn and grieve, and to come to him with it and not stuff it down or turn to something else to ease that pain. He is the source of true hope. So anyway, I just wanted to reinforce that.
[51:55] Laura: Okay how can I redirect a friendship with an unbeliever where I neglected to prioritize sharing my faith? This is a good one because it gets real awkward!
Emily: I think the awkwardness and being in this situation in the past is why I'm trying to be more and more upfront about my faith. Because the longer you wait, the harder it is. So that's just an encouragement. Whenever you meet someone for the first time or the second time or whatever to talk about your faith as soon as it's natural. But a couple of practical tips if you've already gone further in a relationship, is just to share authentically out of the overflow. If someone asks what have you been learning? what have you been reading? what are you listening to? what are you enjoying your life right now? to be able to say oh I've been listening to this podcast it's about motherhood and the gospel! You can use us as an example. Or, maybe you've been reading a non-fiction book and you've been learning about God through that and you can share it with them. Maybe there's something you learned at a Bible study. I think that having that habit—talking about Christ like it's normal—is something that we have to develop in our lives. Not just with unbelievers but with our christian friends too. If we have a hard time talking about Christ in our relationships with our Christians, it is going to be a hundred times harder to do that with an unbeliever. Just a quick practical question—I've learned to ask people something like, You know, I'm not sure I've ever asked—do you go to church anywhere? And sometimes this opens the door to all kinds of interesting conversations. It also offers me a chance to share where I go to church or maybe they've visited churches in the area. I think that's a common response I'll hear from people no we don't really go, but we've tried out this church and that church and then I get to say, Oh I have some friends over there—have you ever met them? It's just a way to open up without going, what do you believe about your soul and your eternal future? So that's one segue question you can try.
Laura: You could also say something like, hey I know I've not talked about this before but I'm a Christian I believe in the power of prayer. Do you mind if I pray for you? I've had anyone tell me, no don't pray for me. Even if they say, yeah if you can pray to your God I'd take that! People often welcome prayer. It is a comfort to know somebody else is praying. For me that's been helpful as I've gotten deeper into relationships. I want to reiterate that Emily has said of it's so helpful to just do it right from the beginning. Recently, we had a big picnic with about 75 people in our neighborhood. My other brother (so not Emily’s husband) prayed before the meal. I was really grateful that he did that. Just setting the precedent—setting the stage. We met all of our new neighbors and we wanted them to know from the start that we’re Christians. I think that that's been helpful and will be helpful as we progress in relationships with them. Yes, it will feel funny. It will feel nerve-racking and you will feel like you didn't say it right...or maybe the person didn't receive it well. But you can trust that God is going to supply what you need to be able to share the gospel with them or just tell them you're a believer. He can do the work in their heart.
Emily: We also get this question a lot from moms who say, I want to go deep with my friends, I want to talk about the gospel, but nobody around me seems to want to talk about it. Some of these same principles can apply. Get women together and say, I know this is awkward I know that this is uncomfortable, but I would love to have deeper conversations with you, I would love to talk about Jesus. Would you like to get together and discuss this book or resource or do a Bible study? Just be the one to say it. Get through the awkward. I think you would be amazed at how many other women in your church and community want to go deeper. But everybody's terrified! Somebody just needs to say it.
Laura: I was literally thumbs-upping Emily as she said that. So often, we get together and we commiserate on the surface level stuff, where we’re willing to admit our sin. But who is willing to take that next step? If there's one person that says, okay...well what truth do you preach to yourself in that moment? How are you finding hope in the gospel? What can we do to get out of this pattern? While it's kind of hard and awkward—that's the next step. I think people are very receptive if there's one person who is sort of willing to go out on a limb. That's something that I love about Risen Motherhood and what were able to do here. We see ourselves as conversation starters—we start to apply the gospel, but there are so many facets and so many directions you could take it. Many of you leave with more questions saying, well what about this? What about that? What about this angle they didn't flesh out? Some of that is intentional on our part, because we want you to keep talking about these things. These conversations are best done in community where you can have conversations and also to not be afraid of disagreement—not be afraid of pushback so that you can have a conversation with one another and kind of leave and say, okay that's an interesting perspective and I want to think more on. As Christians, sometimes we’re afraid of disagreement or afraid of pushing a little bit. That's something that's a real passion point for us—being willing to nudge the conversation just a titch further without everyone having to get offended.
Emily: Yes! Those are some of the best conversations we've had—even with other friends just pushing us and just saying, hey have you thought about this? And even if we don't come to a resolution right away, usually like two months later Laura and I will be like talking and we’ll say, I've been thinking about that and I think my heart is really changing.
Laura: So true.
Emily: You just don’t know how God’s working! Okay, so this was a great Ask Us Anything. We always love interacting with our community in this way and getting to hear from you guys.
Laura: Just like riffing on every little random topic, I love it.
Emily: Definitely go to our website risenmotherhood.com where we have our show notes. We always have lots of information there for you! Remember, there's going to be a blog post that comes out, so if you didn’t hear your question, keep an eye out for that. We're also going to answer some things on Instagram, Facebook Stories this week. There's more to come!
Laura: Lastly don't forget about our shop. It’s open November 4th-11th. It will be a short window of time, so mark your calendars for that. We can't wait to see all of your guys' merch, see what you guys get there are some fun goodies. Okay, I think that's it, right?
Emily: Yup, I’m excited, I’ve got my calendar marked, I want my merch! And that's a wrap folks.